From: CBS%UK.AC.EARN-RELAY::EARN.UICVM::TEISTEER,CBS%UK.AC.EARN-RELAY::EARN.UICVM::U35395 14-APR-1992 21:17:02.93 To: LOU CC: Subj: SC M23, notes on meeting with Japanese visitors Via: UK.AC.EARN-RELAY; Tue, 14 Apr 92 21:16 BST Received: from UKACRL by UK.AC.RL.IB (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 9666; Tue, 14 Apr 92 21:16:14 BST Received: from UICVM by UKACRL.BITNET (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 0536; Tue, 14 Apr 92 21:16:13 BST Received: by UICVM (Mailer R2.07) id 6564; Tue, 14 Apr 92 15:16:03 CDT Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1992 15:11:29 CDT Reply-To: "TEISteer: Text Encoding Initiative Steering Committee List" , "C. M. Sperberg-McQueen" Sender: "TEISteer: Text Encoding Initiative Steering Committee List" From: "C. M. Sperberg-McQueen" Subject: SC M23, notes on meeting with Japanese visitors To: Lou Burnard I append draft minutes from our meeting last Thursday with Makato Nagao, Syun Tutiya, and Mari Nagase. Please send corrections or completions if you have any. I am sending this to the SC only; if we feel we should send a copy to ST, MN, and MNe, I will do so, but would like to feel we are confident in the accuracy of the notes before doing so. -CMSMcQ p.s. as always, tagged text of this is available on request, or by ftp of SCM23.P2X from disk U35395.500 at UICVM, for those with accounts here. ----- Minutes of the Steering Committee Meeting With Japanese Representatives, Oxford, 9 April 1992 TEI SC M23 C. M. Sperberg-McQueen April 14, 1992 (15:04:50) Draft April 14, 1992 (15:04:50) Present: Robert Amsler (RA), Lou Burnard (LB), Susan Hockey (SH), Nancy Ide (NI), Makato Nagao (MN), Mari Nagase (MNe), Michael Sperberg- McQueen (MSM), Syun Tutiya (ST), Don Walker (DW), Antonio Zampolli (AZ). Apologies: none. SH welcomed the three Japanese representatives and explained the background for the discussion: the TEI is planning to move to a new mode of organization to begin ca. mid-1993. Funding needs to be found; we would like to agree on a model for future organization. There will be need for further development work in linguistic analysis, literary study, dictionary and lexical encoding, spoken texts, and other areas. There will also be an increased need for support actiivities (consult- ing, teaching, workshops). Development of software has also been dis- cussed, though without reaching firm conclusions. The TEI envisages continuing its work for another 3-5 years if we can raise the needed funds. The middle or end of 1993 would be a good time to bring in more participation from other bodies and develop a good structure for managing the work with a fair representation of all groups involved. At the TEI report session on Tuesday, ST had surveyed the history of activities in Japan relating to the TEI. DW stressed that the intention and hope of the steering committee was to make Japan an equal partner of Europe and North America in the future organization; a tentative budget calculation for the future of the project suggested that ca. $200,000 per year would be needed from each of the three geographic areas (subject to the kind of program we devel- op), for local and international activities. We have reason to expect Europe can provide this in the future, and we have had funding at this level in the States thus far. MN noted that thus far he had not forecast such a high level of fund- ing; he thought that perhaps $50,000 could be found in Japan. To find $200,000 per year would require new thinking about potential sources. ST reported that MN had filed a proposal for TEI support (and devel- opment of a well controlled corpus) with a tentative budget of ca. 500 million yen. This would fund setting up a committee within Information Processing Society of Japan. (The Information Processing Society seems to be the best choice since umbrella humanities associations such as those sponsoring or participating in the TEI are rare in Japan, and unsympathetic to work with computers. Owing to the recen tstock market crash, 500 million yen is now somewhat less that $50,000. MN felt that such an amount would suffice for national activities: travel expenses for Japanese work group members, but no Japanese salaries, and no con- tribution to the central activities. DW described the organization currently intended for the long-term future: an executive director (full-time, North American or European or Japanese) and two half-time coordinators (in the other two regions); if Japanese institutions can donate the necessary services of a coordinator and secretarial support, then no overt funding for those items would be needed. MN noted that it was very difficult in Japan to hire temporary secretarial support; this would be provided piecemeal by MN's and ST's staff. The current Japanese funding proposal was built on the assump- tion of three trips from Japan to the West and some travel within Japan. AZ suggested several different models for Japanese participation. If MN is confident of having $40,000 to start, we can immediately include Japanese participants within the TEI, within the steering committee and within selected work groups, to begin as early as May or June. DW stressed that in fact the Japanese involvement could not begin then since in fact, with the current meeting and ST's attendance at last November's meeting in Norway it has already begun. The only remaining question is how to fund their participation and how to organize their participation in the program of work. AZ suggested beginning more for- mal participation within the SC as soon as possible, so that the Japa- nese can help decide on the future program of work for which both they and the existing TEI structure are seeking future funding. AZ pointed out that except for funding the editors and committee heads, the Japanese amount of $40,000 or so is equivalent to the funding (for work group travel) forthcoming from European and North American sources. AZ urged that those present formally recognize the de facto equality among the three areas at once; this will assist us in fund- raising. It will make it much easier to talk to the EC and North Ameri- can authorities if the Japanese are fully recognized coparticipants in the TEI as of now. MSM asked whether AZ's proposal would have as a consequence that we should generalize our current principle of approximate parity in WG mem- berships to a principle of parity among all three regions. AZ noted that this principle has always remained an ideal and has not been real- ized rigidly, and suggested that as in the past, our choices of WG par- ticipants should depend on their interests and abilities and our needs. LB objected that most of the WGs have in fact already completed their works; AZ pointed out that of course there was no point in appointing Japanese members to defunct work groups, but argued that continuing work groups should get Japanese members as soon as possible, for the sake of their work for the future. ST clarified that the Association for Information Processing was not intended to be the exclusive locus of activities; other proposals are also going forward. It would perhaps be possible to make a proposal to the Ministry of Education for a joint project; the deadline is approach- ing (end of May?). DW reviewed the proposals for new and further work in document SC W3. MN noted that proposals had to be received in writing in order that they could be shown to appropriate authorities. ST noted that within the framework of the Information Processing Society, activities will be more official than the current TEI Japan Committee, which is informal, volun- tary, and unfunded. ST asked what sort of commitment was being request- ed from the Japanese. LB suggested that Prof. Nagao or his representa- tive should attend the SC meetings which discuss the future. SH summarized as follows the committee's requests for the Japanese: * provide a list of the information requested from the TEI to make possible a good decision * let the steering committee know what sort of level of participation is envisaged by the Japanese * consider whether Japanese participants should be added to any work groups, and which ones * consider what sort of general structure the TEI needs to have in future, and assist in planning how to work toward it The latter two items also apply to the steering committee itself. AZ offered his house in the Dolomites for the next SC meeting, as an inducement to MN to attend. MN noted, in reply to NI, that he was committed to trying to find money for TEI participation, but needed written projections of future activities in order to gauge the amount required. MN said he would make his best effort to send someone to SC meetings for discussions of the future, but stressed that he could not make any guarantees. MNe recalled that though she had known of the TEI since 1986, she had refrained from introducing it to Japan until last year when ST joined in the effort, on the grounds that it was still premature. In general, she viewed the discussions held here positively and hoped the time had come for the work of the TEI to bear fruit in Japan and for Japanese scholars to participate more actively in the TEI. Draft April 14, 1992 (15:04:50)